New New Prospects Thread

[bIueadams 776]

1 hour ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

But you can't judge a players outcome that way. If you put even the best prospects into the NHL before they're fully developed, they will struggle. Anyone will struggle in a league above what their current skill is.

That's just as wrong as assuming that a guy who tears up lower leagues will be a good NHL player. You can't possibly know until their talent plateaus.

Zadina is 22. You can't assume he will be the same player at 25 or 30, that he is now. He may never develop into an impact player, but you can't say for sure, at 22, that he won't get better.

 

 

I watch Veleno and see potential there. He's not great or even good yet, but he's doing the things I want a center to do. In theory he will learn and grow and get better while he keeps playing this way. Maybe he doesn't, but I see the potential he may.

Zadina is a trainwreck. He's hasn't been doing the things I expect a future top 6 winger to do since he first joined us in GR and I had the chance to watch him. Doesn't go to scoring areas, doesn't pick shots correctly, no idea how to approach a board battle let alone win one, can't anticipate an offensive or defensive play. Much like Cholowski there's so much wrong that I see no room for growth. 

If everyone would stop burying their heads in the sand when critiquing young players it wouldn't have taken this long for the fan base to reach the same conclusion that Mackel and I reached seasons ago.

It's not hard to watch a young Bertuzzi and young Zadina and see one does things right and should grow and the other does things terribly wrong. 

[redw1ngs 149]

Zadina hasnt been good. I think his biggest issue ironically enough is his shot. Every shot he takes gets blocked by a defenders body or stick. He either rushes his shot or waits to long to get it off. Either way for a guy that was going to 'fill nets with pucks' hes been rather disappointing. I still believe he could grow tho. I dont think 22yo Zadina is in his final form and I dont think he ends up back in europe. He will carve out a mid6 role for a few years yet just not sure if that will be in Detroit or somewhere else.

[kipwinger 8,675]

Another primary point for Berggren tonight already

[Jonas Mahonas 1,872]

23 hours ago, bIueadams said:

I watch Veleno and see potential there. He's not great or even good yet, but he's doing the things I want a center to do. In theory he will learn and grow and get better while he keeps playing this way. Maybe he doesn't, but I see the potential he may.

Zadina is a trainwreck. He's hasn't been doing the things I expect a future top 6 winger to do since he first joined us in GR and I had the chance to watch him. Doesn't go to scoring areas, doesn't pick shots correctly, no idea how to approach a board battle let alone win one, can't anticipate an offensive or defensive play. Much like Cholowski there's so much wrong that I see no room for growth. 

If everyone would stop burying their heads in the sand when critiquing young players it wouldn't have taken this long for the fan base to reach the same conclusion that Mackel and I reached seasons ago.

It's not hard to watch a young Bertuzzi and young Zadina and see one does things right and should grow and the other does things terribly wrong. 

Bertuzzi is 27.

[mackel 737]

2 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Bertuzzi is 27.

[kipwinger 8,675]

 

[bIueadams 776]

1 hour ago, kipwinger said:

 

Seems to be younger and better than Brome.

Forwards are gonna log jammed though huh

Larkin, Bertuzzi, Vrana, Fabbri, Raymond, Suter, Rasmussen, Sundqvist, Erne, Stephens, Smith, Zadina, Veleno, Andreasson. That's 14 already and we're not even at UFA. Trades?

[kipwinger 8,675]

1 minute ago, bIueadams said:

Seems to be younger and better than Brome.

Forwards are gonna log jammed though huh

Larkin, Bertuzzi, Vrana, Fabbri, Raymond, Suter, Rasmussen, Sundqvist, Erne, Stephens, Smith, Zadina, Veleno, Andreasson. That's 14 already and we're not even at UFA. Trades?

I'm thinking he's reinforcements for GR should they make the playoffs. They're flirting with the post season despite having an impressively horrible roster.

[bIueadams 776]

1 hour ago, kipwinger said:

I'm thinking he's reinforcements for GR should they make the playoffs. They're flirting with the post season despite having an impressively horrible roster.

I think Pontus will have to clear waivers. Correct me if I'm wrong.

More thinking about next season. Veleno seems pegged to make the roster. Pearson will be 25. Andreasson will be 24. Even if we keep them all down we're at x12 forwards. Kinda tight.

Vrana - Larkin - Raymond
Fabbri - Suter - Bertuzzi
Erne - Rasmussen - Sundqvist
Smith - Stephens - Zadina

Hanas - Veleno - Berggren
Pearson - Andreasson

Could waive or bench Smith to make room for Veleno... but we're still one roster forward addition before that negates that option.

 

[kipwinger 8,675]

3 hours ago, bIueadams said:

I think Pontus will have to clear waivers. Correct me if I'm wrong.

More thinking about next season. Veleno seems pegged to make the roster. Pearson will be 25. Andreasson will be 24. Even if we keep them all down we're at x12 forwards. Kinda tight.

Vrana - Larkin - Raymond
Fabbri - Suter - Bertuzzi
Erne - Rasmussen - Sundqvist
Smith - Stephens - Zadina

Hanas - Veleno - Berggren
Pearson - Andreasson

Could waive or bench Smith to make room for Veleno... but we're still one roster forward addition before that negates that option.

 

I think the short answer is that a bunch of those guys aren't on the roster next year. I'm not positive Fabbri is ready to go by October, given that guys with ACL tears usually end up missing about a full year. Next most likely is a trade or two (Zadina and Suter are primed for this, to a lesser extent Veleno and Ras too). Then others will be injured during training camp and the  pre-season. Finally, (as you mentioned) some guys will be waived if nothing else (Smith, Stephen, Erne).

And despite all this, I think they re-sign Gagner for the 4th line (which I'm okay with).

New guy Pontus Andreasson: Two goals today in the SHL playoffs.

 

[bIueadams 776]

4 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

I think the short answer is that a bunch of those guys aren't on the roster next year. I'm not positive Fabbri is ready to go by October, given that guys with ACL tears usually end up missing about a full year. Next most likely is a trade or two (Zadina and Suter are primed for this, to a lesser extent Veleno and Ras too). Then others will be injured during training camp and the  pre-season. Finally, (as you mentioned) some guys will be waived if nothing else (Smith, Stephen, Erne).

And despite all this, I think they re-sign Gagner for the 4th line (which I'm okay with).

Forgot about Fabbri. ACL tears in both knees now... that could be career ending/changing for him.

Don't want to see Stephen's waived. Erne sucks this year, but I don't think he gets waived in the hopes he bounces back enough to be traded at the TDL. Smith sucks and can be waived.

I have no problem with Gagner, I'd just rather use his roster position on someone else.

Vrana - Larkin - Raymond
Bertuzzi - Suter - Sundqvist
Rasmussen - Veleno - Zadina
Erne - Stepehens - Andreasson/Pearson

That looks a bit better with Fabbri injured, Smith waived, and Gagner released. Enough room to sign another forward to push Andreasson/Pearson off the roster.

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

Veleno will be on the opening night roster. Pearson will be the recall guy on the roster. Berggren will be up if he"s ready. New guy will depend on what happens with Berggren, I think. A lot of bottom 6 guys already and Soderblom knocking on the door.

[TLGTrico 647]

Viro's moving on to round two of the Liiga playoffs

Edited April 7, 2022 by TLGTrico

[redw1ngs 149]

5 hours ago, TLGTrico said:

Viro's moving on to round two of the Liiga playoffs

Viro sucks Tuomisto sucks Kotkansalo sucks. Stop drafting finish defensemen. They all suck.

Oh and Juolevi sucks.

Draft more Swedish defensemen. Edvinsson Wallinder Johansson Lindstrom are the future.

[ely s 458]

37 minutes ago, redw1ngs said:

... Edvinsson Wallinder Johansson Lindstrom are the future.

I think this name is too long...

[redw1ngs 149]

1 hour ago, ely s said:

I think this name is too long...

JEWLarethefuture

swedishmafiaisthefuture

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

9:15

Spot on Shannon.

[bIueadams 776]

3 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

9:15

Spot on Shannon.

"I think Zadina has looked better than what his numbers will tell you"

Tell me you haven't watched Zadina, without telling me you haven't watched Zadina.

[kipwinger 8,675]

20 hours ago, bIueadams said:

Forgot about Fabbri. ACL tears in both knees now... that could be career ending/changing for him.

Don't want to see Stephen's waived. Erne sucks this year, but I don't think he gets waived in the hopes he bounces back enough to be traded at the TDL. Smith sucks and can be waived.

I have no problem with Gagner, I'd just rather use his roster position on someone else.

Vrana - Larkin - Raymond
Bertuzzi - Suter - Sundqvist
Rasmussen - Veleno - Zadina
Erne - Stepehens - Andreasson/Pearson

That looks a bit better with Fabbri injured, Smith waived, and Gagner released. Enough room to sign another forward to push Andreasson/Pearson off the roster.

My "sure to make the playoffs" next year roster:

Ras-Larkin-Raymond

Bert-Barzal-Vrana

Berggren-Veleno-Sodorblom

Erne-Stephens-Sundqvist

Smith/Gagner

 

Kulak-Seider

Edvinsson-Hronek

Walman-Lindstrom

Staal

 

Trade:

To Detroit: Matt Barzal

To NYI: Suter-Zadina-2022 2nd, 2023 1st.

[bIueadams 776]

20 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

My "sure to make the playoffs" next year roster:

Ras-Larkin-Raymond

Bert-Barzal-Vrana

Berggren-Veleno-Sodorblom

Erne-Stephens-Sundqvist

Smith/Gagner

 

Kulak-Seider

Edvinsson-Hronek

Walman-Lindstrom

Staal

 

Trade:

To Detroit: Matt Barzal

To NYI: Suter-Zadina-2022 2nd, 2023 1st.

Consensus on the NYI boards seems to be the top priority is a LHD to pair with Dobson. Unfortunately the one thing we are severely lacking. They are also very much in compete now mode, and wouldn't want Johansson or Wallinder. They want roster players. My guess is Lou is asking for Edvinsson plus Bertuzzi in return for Barzal.

If they are serious about trading Barzal, I think they're more likely to deal with Arizona and Chychrun.

Also interesting to note... Pius Suter was invited to and attended Islanders training camp like 3 years ago and was cut and not offered a contract. Their opinion of him is probably 100% different now, but still an interesting point.

[kipwinger 8,675]

5 minutes ago, bIueadams said:

Consensus on the NYI boards seems to be the top priority is a LHD to pair with Dobson. Unfortunately the one thing we are severely lacking. They are also very much in compete now mode, and wouldn't want Johansson or Wallinder. They want roster players. My guess is Lou is asking for Edvinsson plus Bertuzzi in return for Barzal.

If they are serious about trading Barzal, I think they're more likely to deal with Arizona and Chychrun.

Also interesting to note... Pius Suter was invited to and attended Islanders training camp like 3 years ago and was cut and not offered a contract. Their opinion of him is probably 100% different now, but still an interesting point.

I don't see any scenario in which the Islanders trade Barzal and still "compete now". You've got to imagine trading him means they're retooling. I don't see them wanting a Bertuzzi in that case. Suter's just a warm body to flip next year, the real value is the picks.

[redw1ngs 149]

Brattstrom had a rough start to his NA pro career but has come on as of late with a 0.926sv% in his last 4gp including last night stopping 35/36 through OT and 11/12 in the shootout to give GR the 2-1 win.

[bIueadams 776]

5 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

I don't see any scenario in which the Islanders trade Barzal and still "compete now". You've got to imagine trading him means they're retooling. I don't see them wanting a Bertuzzi in that case. Suter's just a warm body to flip next year, the real value is the picks.

A lot of fans seem to think Barzal is overrated and overpaid. I think that's the motivation for moving him. They have other centers and would rather spend that $7 mil on Dmen.

Pelech - Pulock
_____ - Dobson
_____ - Mayfield

They have serious needs on the left side.

I don't disagree they're retooling. But I think that's the retool angle. Unloading Barzal to bring in Dmen and compete now.

We're probably not the right dancing partner for them.

 

[TLGTrico 647]

Edvinsson, Soderblom and Niederbach advancing the SHL playoffs.  Johansson also one game away.

[bIueadams 776]

https://www.mlive.com/redwings/2022/04/michael-rasmussen-driving-the-bus-right-now-for-red-wings.html?utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=redwings_sf

Larkin and Blash have some nice things to say about Ras. Basically that he's becoming a key player. Matches up against the toughest opponents. Wins board battles. Finally finding his confidence scoring. 

Guy turns 23 in a few days. Still needs to add about 20-30 lbs of muscle. But I think he's worth holding on to. Could still be a Hanzal.