Shawn Thornton attacks Orpik (leaves game on stretcher)

[miksteri 55]

http://kuklaskorner.com/hockey/comments/chris-kelly-out-with-broken-ankle well well well, and theres more, but again, another pen will get away with s***... thanks Mario...

[Wingsfan72 198]

http://kuklaskorner.com/hockey/comments/chris-kelly-out-with-broken-ankle well well well, and theres more, but again, another pen will get away with s***... thanks Mario...

That looked a lot like he was going for the puck...

[cusimano_brothers 1,655]

This is exactly the kind on game that the NHL on NBC needs to attract new fans.

[WingsAlways 486]

If you think what Crosby did was dirty you need to re-evaluate your definition of dirty. I dislike Crosby as much as the next guy, but come on dude, he was playing the puck and tripped a guy. Let's not be the site that makes up s*** Crosby does when there is plenty he does that we don't have to exaggerate. You also need to look up what a slew-foot is. A good example is what Thornton did to Orpik before he started punching.

And you need to look up what exaggeration is, after all I posted a video look of another angle. I saw a skate hit a skate, I guess it was accidental right? I guess that's why he hauled his ass off the ice so fast instead of staying at the side of his injured teammate which was the point of my post.

[Wings_Dynasty 267]

And you need to look up what exaggeration is, after all I posted a video look of another angle. I saw a skate hit a skate, I guess it was accidental right? I guess that's why he hauled his ass off the ice so fast instead of staying at the side of his injured teammate which was the point of my post.

After watching it again I think I can man up and say... yes, you are still exaggerating.

Yes, it looked accidental. May not have been accidental, but he was turning (which usually causes a leg to stick out), and trying to poke the puck away (which usually causes the stick to stick out). It looks like their skates connect and Marchand trips over Crosby's skate and stick. Probably should have been called a trip by the trailing ref. Nothing too menacing or underhanded, even if done deliberately.

After the contact, Crosby skates to the bench for a line change. At this point he had been on the ice for an average amount of time. He made his way toward the bench but stopped short of going off because of the whistle from the Neil kneeing. He lingered for a moment then got off the ice, this occured during the scrum in the Pens zone but BEFORE Thornton grabbed Orpik. He got off the ice and was replaced by another player, THEN Thornton attacked Orpik.

So, thanks for making me defend Crosby. Are you happy? I feel like Johnny Cochran.

Edited December 8, 2013 by Wings_Dynasty

[kylee 727]

Deserves 50 games.

[Kmahrle83 61]

I hate the Pens as much as the next Wings fan, but what Thornton did was uncalled for and def not part of the hockey 'code.' Seems almost certain that he will be suspended. Hopefully Orpik is okay.

When I made the thread about bringing the law in, this is what I had in mind. Absolutely intending to injure and gutless. Thornton should not be allowed to play if he can't control himself. My stomach just turns seeing this stuff.

[Hockeymom1960 5,107]

When I made the thread about bringing the law in, this is what I had in mind. Absolutely intending to injure and gutless. Thornton should not be allowed to play if he can't control himself. My stomach just turns seeing this stuff.

So should Neal then because he intended to injure.

[BadgerBob 297]

I know neither players history regarding suspensions in the past; if I were placing a bet on this - I'd say Neal might get a 'slap on the wrist' (as in no games, or maybe 3, or 4 games max), and since Thornton's a legit 'tuff guy' he'll get nothing less than 5 - probably closer to 8 to 10 games.

Thornton has never been previously suspended, however I know for a fact Neal has been suspended at least one time in the past for a dirty hit in that crazy playoff series with the Flyers. Even though he's a repeat offender, I am sure you're right about the suspension lengths even though I think Neal's punishment should be just as much if not more than Thornton's.

[dirtydangles 1,328]

So pathetic - the NHL is reviewing Neal's "kneeing" incident within the rule for kneeing? How is this any different that a deliberate elbow to the head blindside? So what if it was a knee. Should be an in person hearing with over 5 games suspension. He will get 2 for a dirtier play than most - a lot of head shots can be unintentional and end up being penalized a lot worse.

[GMRwings1983 8,802]

Thanks for the info

Now - I'd like to ask the LGW community here what their thoughts are on this...I can understand how many loathe what Thornton did to Orpik - however our very own McCarty jumped an unsuspecting Lemieux back in 1997...After learning more about Orpik's tendency of borderline hits, and not answering the bell (although I think we can all agree Lemieux was far more despicable) - do some here find what McCarty did as 'acceptable', or was it a cheap shot along the same level of what we saw with Thornton?

Like I said earlier, the result makes everything look worse. Think Bertuzzi on Moore.

If McCarty beat Lemieux into a stretcher with those punches (which I'm sure he wouldn't have minded doing), the entire situation would be looked upon differently. Instead of seeing it as a great hockey memory, a lot of people would see it as another instance of hockey brutality with a tragic result.

Also, remember Weber ramming Zetterberg's head in the glass. If Zetterberg was taken away on a stretcher, I can see Weber getting 10 games out of that. Instead, he got s***.

Here, we have gloved punches which seriously hurt a player. We see gloved punches all the time that don't do nearly as much damage, if at all. I do think Thornton should be suspended, but this incident wouldn't even be on the news if Orpik didn't get hurt so badly.

Edited December 9, 2013 by GMRwings1983

[frankgrimes 1,836]

I think Claud Julien nailed it, basically said:

Thornton obviously crossed the line, but so did team Bettman known as the Penguins.

If Shanahan wants to send a message:

Thornton: 10 games - disgusting and he knows it

Neal: 8 games - that wasn't kneeing this was an intent with the head as principal point of contact according to rule #48 ..didn't even show any remorse what an idiot

Orpik: phone hearing = less than 5 games

I am sure it's also just bad luck, that everytime a game goes out of hand the Penguins are involved...maybe thats the Mario L. & Sindy C. bonus...

Personally, I still love the type of grit and caring McCarty has shown that's the type of team bounding I love to watch. Like Downey said, you can hit the players but if you cross the line someone will come out and make you pay for it. Sometimes I think people are forgetting, that this hockey not a sport for the soccer mums and dads of the world

Edited December 9, 2013 by frankgrimes

[kipwinger 8,732]

I think Claud Julien nailed it, basically said:

Thornton obviously crossed the line, but so did team Bettman known as the Penguins.

If Shanahan wants to send a message:

Thornton: 10 games - disgusting and he knows it

Neal: 8 games - that wasn't kneeing this was an intent with the head as principal point of contact according to rule #48 ..didn't even show any remorse what an idiot

Orpik: phone hearing = less than 5 games

I am sure it's also just bad luck, that everytime a game goes out of hand the Penguins are involved...maybe thats the Mario L. & Sindy C. bonus...

Personally, I still love the type of grit and caring McCarty has shown that's the type of team bounding I love to watch. Like Downey said, you can hit the players but if you cross the line someone will come out and make you pay for it. Sometimes I think people are forgetting, that this hockey not a sport for the soccer mums and dads of the world

You think you could knock off the baiting, it's obnoxious?

[Ally 448]

The knee honestly bothers me more but Thornton still deserves a suspension.

[Nev 1,085]

I think Claud Julien nailed it, basically said:

Thornton obviously crossed the line, but so did team Bettman known as the Penguins.

Did he really call them Team Bettman?

And kipwinger is right, you need to knock it off with the Soccer Moms schtick, it does your arguments no favour.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros 1,029]

Unbelievable that Thornton is going to get more than Neal. That knee by Neal is a classic example of what the league wants to get rid of. It was intentional, he made no effort to avoid it, and the principle point of contact was the head. If Marchand was taken off on a stretcher, Neal would've got a hell of a lot more time off than he will. This is the problem with making calls and handing out suspensions based on the end result.

What Thornton did to Orpik was cheap. However, if Orpik gets up after that, Thornton might not even be suspended for it. Orpik throws big hits and plays on the edge, but he has his gloves superglued to his hands. He'll get into scrums and talk s*** but runs away when challenged to drop the gloves. He never answers the bell for anything.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

Did he really call them Team Bettman?

And kipwinger is right, you need to knock it off with the Soccer Moms schtick, it does your arguments no favour.

Nope team Bettman is my nickname for that team, after all the stuff they are getting away with.

Doesn't matter to me, its just annoying reading the same headlines everytime something like this is happening. If people don't like the game fine, don't watch it but stop pushing an agenda.

Neals hit could have been way worse the guy is skating with protectors on his knee through the head of a player, who happens to lay down on the ice that's disgusting and extremely dangerous. The department of player safety needs to look at the intent and then at the result, if Thornton is getting extensively more than Neal something in this league is really really wrong..if this happened to Crosby Mario and the whole Penguins organization would cry bloody murder.

[kipwinger 8,732]

Nope team Bettman is my nickname for that team, after all the stuff they are getting away with.

Doesn't matter to me, its just annoying reading the same headlines everytime something like this is happening. If people don't like the game fine, don't watch it but stop pushing an agenda.

Neals hit could have been way worse the guy is skating with protectors on his knee through the head of a player, who happens to lay down on the ice that's disgusting and extremely dangerous. The department of player safety needs to look at the intent and then at the result, if Thornton is getting extensively more than Neal something in this league is really really wrong..if this happened to Crosby Mario and the whole Penguins organization would cry bloody murder.

There are two problems with your argument and how you present it. First, fighting isn't part of the game, hence it's against the rules and is a penalty. Secondly, you repeatedly call anyone who disagrees with you "soccer moms and dads", and tell everyone else to go watch something else if they don't agree. Both are decidedly against the forum rules as well as piss poor ways of defending your point of view. Not withstanding that fact that you inexplicably get away with your baiting over and over and over again, one has to wonder why (if you're such a fan of something that isn't part of the game) you don't go watch MMA or boxing. Instead, you prefer to tell everyone else to watch something else whenever they suggest that perhaps the game they love shouldn't be turned into a dangerous freak show because of flagrant and repeated disregard for the rules of the sport.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

There are two problems with your argument and how you present it. First, fighting isn't part of the game, hence it's against the rules and is a penalty. Secondly, you repeatedly call anyone who disagrees with you "soccer moms and dads", and tell everyone else to go watch something else if they don't agree. Both are decidedly against the forum rules as well as piss poor ways of defending your point of view. Not withstanding that fact that you inexplicably get away with your baiting over and over and over again, one has to wonder why (if you're such a fan of something that isn't part of the game) you don't go watch MMA or boxing. Instead, you prefer to tell everyone else to watch something else whenever they suggest that perhaps the game they love shouldn't be turned into a dangerous freak show because of flagrant and repeated disregard for the rules of the sport.

Says the guy, who is trying in every damn thread to "analyse" the opinion of others. Soccer mums and hockey dads is not used for anyone specifically it's simple a term, because +in general+ the same discussions are happening on every board, every year ..more scoring, remove this and that...so it's warranted like it or not., just a simple term so stop reaching and stay on topic. I also don't need to defend my arguments, some agree some disagree so I could care less, if someone thinks I'm wrong or right.

Secondly I don't need others telling me, what is part of the game and what isn't since I know it, thanks.

Anyway back to topic

Bylsma has no problem with the hit from Orpik, maybe they should have asked him about the Neal thing, I am sure he doesn't have a problem with that either if it happened to Malkin or Crosby he would sing a different tune. That's exactly the reason why I can't stand the Penguins they are so talented but extremely hypocrites, Julien was honest and of course right.

[kipwinger 8,732]

Says the guy, who is trying in every damn thread to "analyse" the opinion of others. Soccer mums and hockey dads is not used for anyone specifically it's simple a term, because +in general+ the same discussions are happening on every board, every year ..more scoring, remove this and that...so it's warranted like it or not., just a simple term so stop reaching and stay on topic. I also don't need to defend my arguments, some agree some disagree so I could care less, if someone thinks I'm wrong or right.

Secondly I don't need others telling me, what is part of the game and what isn't since I know it, thanks.

Anyway back to topic

Bylsma has no problem with the hit from Orpik, maybe they should have asked him about the Neal thing, I am sure he doesn't have a problem with that either if it happened to Malkin or Crosby he would sing a different tune. That's exactly the reason why I can't stand the Penguins they are so talented but extremely hypocrites, Julien was honest and of course right.

Isn't it the point of a discussion forum to "analyse" what others say and respond? I suppose I could just say something, and then call people names when they disagree with me and tell them to watch another sport.

p.s. Did you put "analyse" in quotes because you intentionally misspelled it, or was that just some sort of hilarious irony?

[kipwinger 8,732]

Man - you really are a stickler for details

Anyone remember this? Domi was given an 8 game suspension by Brian Burke. Just think what he'd get today.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AETBie8XqA4

Not really, I don't care when people misspell things. I do it all the time. It's just funny that he put the word in quotes, while misspelling it, while trying to take a jab at me, while trying to use a word that means "examine methodically and in detail".

[Wings_Toledo 233]

In a way, I'm kind of glad that Thornton went after Orpik like that. The Penguins get away with far too many dirty plays that sometimes cause serious injuries. Thornton went too far with the repeated blows to the head after Orpik went down, but message sent. No one likes to see anyone get hurt like that, though.

Neal should get the same suspension because his knee to the head was just flat out disgusting and targeting a player who was already down as well.

[Dabura 12,228]

Instead, you prefer to tell everyone else to watch something else whenever they suggest that perhaps the game they love shouldn't be turned into a dangerous freak show because of flagrant and repeated disregard for the rules of the sport.

The Norris Division was a dangerous (and entertaining) freak show. Today's leaugue is, by comparison, a(n entertaining) petting zoo.

Just saying.

[dobbles 252]

i wish thornton wouldn't have did what he did so the focal point in the media would have been how big a ******-canoe neal is. i wish he would have ended up with the longer suspension out of all of this. what he did was totally cowardly.

i think how it played out is really unfortunate. orpik goes off on a stretcher from a couple gloved punches so it makes thornton out to be the worst dude in the history of the world, but since marchand is disliked by most and was able to get off the ice, his injury was no big deal.

i wish the league punished more for intent an not on theatrics. thornton shouldnt have slew footed and he shouldnt have punched a guy thats down. but at the end of the day he was trying to fight a guy that had made a borderline dirty hit. i can understand someone getting caught up in the passion of the game and making the mistake he did. whereas neal's actions just make me not want to be a hockey fan when people can get away with dirty plays like that. honestly that is worse thaneven lemiuex on draper IMO.

[kipwinger 8,732]

The Norris Division was a dangerous (and entertaining) freak show. Today's leaugue is, by comparison, a(n entertaining) petting zoo.

Just saying.

I'm not sure what you're "just saying".