WCSF Game 2 GDT : Red Wings 4 at Blackhawks 1 - (Series Tied at 1)

[Hockeymom1960 5,107]

OH NOES! Another Chicago Tribune writer needs his bottle and a nap. The headline?

Wings play extra tough with Toews

Awwwwww, they're playing hockey against us. That's not fair. We're the #1 seed and we've spent months calling this team invincible. We should get every call in every game. It worked for Jordan. HEY LEAGUE, stop letting them check our players. The writer gives Toews a chance to fill his diaper:

"It's just tough to understand sometimes why we get roughing penalties and hooking penalties, whatever it is, and it doesn't go both ways," Toews said. "If that's the way it's going to be, well, we need to understand that and play more physical and be tougher on them. We'll know that going into the next one.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/hockey/blackhawks/ct-spt-0519-side-blackhawks-red-wings-chicago-20130519,0,4395897.story

Not setting a good example here Toews, especially when you're the captain. This just makes you sound like a whiner. Here's your padifier now go take a nap.

[hillbillywingsfan 794]

Sure they did. I mean, don't get me wrong - I'm not saying we didn't flat-out own this game. We did. And it was Glorious. But we definitely had a little "help."

Give me a break. What about 2 games in a row now Maid Marian has done his perfect impression of Greg Louganis not getting called. Don't you think that makes up for the non calls? You know how many times Abby,Cleary and company get cross checked in front of crawford I seen not get called. The high cross check to the neck that didn't get called In the first game that should of had Chicago in the box again...If anything both teams have gotten help pretty much equally.

[winginKentucky 1]

Give me a break. What about 2 games in a row now Maid Marian has done his perfect impression of Greg Louganis not getting called. Don't you think that makes up for the non calls? You know how many times Abby,Cleary and company get cross checked in front of crawford I seen not get called. The high cross check to the neck that didn't get called In the first game that should of had Chicago in the box again...If anything both teams have gotten help pretty much equally.

Cant deny that

I missed the first two periods so I have no idea what the penalty situation was. Started watching right as franzen booked one.

But when I was watching it pretty much looked like a mugging and Chitown got away with it. IMO anyway for what thats worth.

Edited May 19, 2013 by winginKentucky

[SDavis35 140]

I don't remember any specific plays that were blatant penalties by the Wings that got overlooked. If you have the puck and are controlling play more, the less likely you are to commit infractions. Toews should know this on a puck possession team.

This was just one team being far better than the other. The refs influence outcomes all too often in the NHL these days, but it's silly to claim a little physical play prevented Chicago from winning. Toews doesn't care that Shaw skates around like an idiot though nearly every shift?

CBC was replaying the "should've been called" highlights several times, and Zetterberg was rough on Toews, but nothing that deserves a playoff penalty (probably not even a regualr season call). It's a part of the game, Holmstrom made a career off taking far worse clobberings.

[Rhah 195]

CBC was replaying the "should've been called" highlights several times, and Zetterberg was rough on Toews, but nothing that deserves a playoff penalty (probably not even a regualr season call). It's a part of the game, Holmstrom made a career off taking far worse clobberings.

Plus how many were open ice and how many were close to around the net? Our players have been getting mugged in front of Crawford with zero calls, seems to be the norm that anything goes in front of the net, hazards of the job.

[SDavis35 140]

Worth noting: that was the real Wings. When they all show up to play, and they've got a chip on their collective shoulders, and they stick to their systems, and they remember to take their chill pills during the second intermission, etc. - that is what you get. That is what they could be every game.

Maybe I'm crazy... but I think they have played better games than that even... not that I don't appreciate the effort they put down tonight!! I just think the Hawks will have another level, and we have another level. This should be a fun series no doubt.

[Aznknight 139]

I friggin love our 3rd line. When they reach their potential (hopefully sooner rather than later), this team is gonna be top again.

If Helm and Dekeyser was playing, the Hawks would be going to Hockeytown down 2 games.

[kylee 727]

Pretty quiet over on HFboards today from the Hawks fan huh? I don't really take them too seriously, there are far too many trolls on that main board that post all the time just to read their own replies, but through in through, this was the best game Detroit played this year. Period. If Detroit can keep this up they really will have a real chance to win this series.

[13dangledangle 968]

Franzen and Flip still without a shot on goal.

Nice call...hahaha

[Datsyukian-Deke 722]

Toews whining about officiating is as messed up as the pronunciation of his last name.

[Mike J. 132]

Today was a hell of a game, the first half of it was kind of iffy but you could tell they were playing with some fire. The second half of the game was just all Wings. The way I wish it was every game. Flip's goal was so sick!

[Guest Hatethedrake!]

So proud of this Red Wings team. Let's keep it going!

[Guest Playmaker]

Smith is a rookie who is going to make mistakes. Pucks will get past you at the point. If Cleary does his job, it's a good scoring chance, and nothing more. He's a seasoned playoff veteran and shouldn't be making plays like this. Cleary isn't the scapegoat. He's getting well deserved criticism for his extremely poor play.[/quote

What you call "well-deserved criticism" is what I'd call obsessive overkill. He is not playing well. But Cleary commentary has gone from well-chosen, logical and timely remarks to a kind of pubescent, smart-ass, sarcastic let's-all-dump-on-him-because-it's-the-current-thing-to-do thing. Kind of like mindless, absentee bullying. What I find interesting about my own reaction is that whether it's my business or not; and even though I don't have any control over it, I feel embarrassed and sad for those of you who are persisting, even when he plays ok. It's just a guess here. A stab in the dark? But I'm thinking the point has been made that Daniel Cleary is not playing well.

Sorry, but I think the both of you are being a bit overly sensitive. Like I said, I don't have a history of bashing or doing the "TRADE HIM" bit if someone has a bad game and I can't control what anyone else does or says. But the bottom line is, for two full seasons, Cleary has been a shell of his former self. He struggles with many basic things like clearing the zone or taking the right guy defensively (which wouldn't be so bad if his "defensive prowess" wasn't constantly given as his reason for being in the line up every day) His skating is painfully slow. He rarely hits any more has litte playmaking ability left and doesn't seem capable of standing in front of the net to make a play. That doesn't take away what he did in the past and it doesn't mean he doesn't occasionally make a decent play, nor does it mean other players aren't struggling as well.

This is almost like a Brandon Inge reinicarnation. The guy was hitting a buck fifty and trotted out as the starting 3B every day and was actually given a shot at 2B when Cabrera moved to third and yet if you said anything, you were a "hater" and a "bully". Then once in a blue moon he'd get like an infield squibber or field a basic ground ball, and it was like "See!!! Look at how good he is! He made that play!"

Oh, AND he's good in the community! Well, so was Mother Theresa, but I don't want her playing on my team.

He's been a completely ineffective player, yet every game this season, there he is with Datsyuk and Zetterberg, on the PP, on the ice in the final minute of a game while guys like Eaves, Miller and others are sitting in the press box on any given night and while guys like Tatar are wasting away in Grand Rapids. Most of his goals are the result of him being the last guy it hit on the way to the net and a great many of his assists are him just getting the puck to 13 or 40 and having them do their magic. When Brunner was having a bad stretch he was pulled from the lineup, made to sit a few games and then was reinsterted on the 3rd line. When Ian White and Carlo Colaiocovo struggled, they were benched in favor of young players. Same with Tootoo, Berrtuzzi and Samuelsson. Not Cleary.

I was willing to give Cleary the benefit of the doubt last season because it was supposedly his bad knees and once he had surgery over the summer, he'd be back to his old self. That didn't happen. His decline has continued. But there he is, in the lineup, in the top 6 game after game. I suppose that's on Babcock. I have a great deal of respect for him, but I don't agree with him on how he's handled Cleary. His blind devotion is baffling.

I'm not here as often as many others are, but I haven't seen nearly as much Cleary bashing as I have for Franzen, Filppula, Smith, and Quincey. No one has called him "Danielle" and I haven't seen any personal attacks, mostly just pointing out his poor play during a game day thread.

[cusimano_brothers 1,655]

Shouldn't the captain let the coach complain about what they consider to be "bad" officiating in the media?

[Seraph 240]

Whatever, if the Hawks want to skate around like a bunch of idiots to match our imaginary infractions, then be our guest. That will only help us get more calls.

Chicago has a lot of skill and knows how to do a lot of things, but apparently one thing they didn't learn this year was how to respond appropriately to a defeat. Hopefully it will be their downfall.

[MidMichSteve 1,115]

Patrick Kane on the Red Wings: “They controlled the puck a lot and we didn’t, so they kind of used our own game against us playing puck possession, keeping it in (our end) and I thought we were chasing it all game.”

Link

25 cents sounds more like a Captain than Towes. That's sad.

Mike Babcock on home ice: “I don't know if that makes any difference whatsoever. Let's just play. They got a real good club. They've been good all year. We got a real good club now. We haven't been good all year. We kept getting better. We're confident in our group. We think we can be in this series and we're excited about the opportunity.''

[Vladifan 680]

Sorry, but I think the both of you are being a bit overly sensitive. Like I said, I don't have a history of bashing or doing the "TRADE HIM" bit if someone has a bad game and I can't control what anyone else does or says. But the bottom line is, for two full seasons, Cleary has been a shell of his former self. He struggles with many basic things like clearing the zone or taking the right guy defensively (which wouldn't be so bad if his "defensive prowess" wasn't constantly given as his reason for being in the line up every day) His skating is painfully slow. He rarely hits any more has litte playmaking ability left and doesn't seem capable of standing in front of the net to make a play. That doesn't take away what he did in the past and it doesn't mean he doesn't occasionally make a decent play, nor does it mean other players aren't struggling as well.

This is almost like a Brandon Inge reinicarnation. The guy was hitting a buck fifty and trotted out as the starting 3B every day and was actually given a shot at 2B when Cabrera moved to third and yet if you said anything, you were a "hater" and a "bully". Then once in a blue moon he'd get like an infield squibber or field a basic ground ball, and it was like "See!!! Look at how good he is! He made that play!"

Oh, AND he's good in the community! Well, so was Mother Theresa, but I don't want her playing on my team.

He's been a completely ineffective player, yet every game this season, there he is with Datsyuk and Zetterberg, on the PP, on the ice in the final minute of a game while guys like Eaves, Miller and others are sitting in the press box on any given night and while guys like Tatar are wasting away in Grand Rapids. Most of his goals are the result of him being the last guy it hit on the way to the net and a great many of his assists are him just getting the puck to 13 or 40 and having them do their magic. When Brunner was having a bad stretch he was pulled from the lineup, made to sit a few games and then was reinsterted on the 3rd line. When Ian White and Carlo Colaiocovo struggled, they were benched in favor of young players. Same with Tootoo, Berrtuzzi and Samuelsson. Not Cleary.

I was willing to give Cleary the benefit of the doubt last season because it was supposedly his bad knees and once he had surgery over the summer, he'd be back to his old self. That didn't happen. His decline has continued. But there he is, in the lineup, in the top 6 game after game. I suppose that's on Babcock. I have a great deal of respect for him, but I don't agree with him on how he's handled Cleary. His blind devotion is baffling.

I'm not here as often as many others are, but I haven't seen nearly as much Cleary bashing as I have for Franzen, Filppula, Smith, and Quincey. No one has called him "Danielle" and I haven't seen any personal attacks, mostly just pointing out his poor play during a game day thread.

One more time. Most everyone would agree with your assessment. That again, has been re-hashed countless times. Although I thought your purposefully bringing in the name "Danielle" at this point was at least, thought-provoking. But unless you have Babcock's ear, or unless you have more clout/control than I assume you have, you nor any of the rest of us here can do jack about the situation. The situation IS what it IS. Cleary, no matter what his perceived level of play is, does not play for you. He plays for the Detroit Red Wings team and Mike Babcock ultimately and unassailably chooses who's going to play. So when you say you were willing to give Cleary the benefit of the doubt that's all fine and dandy, but it's also a useless, almost laughable statement. I am done discussing this. Neither of us will change each other's minds and it's been regurgitated to death.

[Z and D for the C 712]

Playmaker, I just wanted to say that's a pretty good assessment of Danielle's play recently.

But unless you have Babcock's ear, or unless you have more clout/control than I assume you have, you nor any of the rest of us here can do jack about the situation. The situation IS what it IS. Cleary, no matter what his perceived level of play is, does not play for you. He plays for the Detroit Red Wings team and Mike Babcock ultimately and unassailably chooses who's going to play.

So what is the point of any of us discussing anything, then? Is this just a forum for us to say "I hope the wings win!". Come on, man.

[Z Winged Dangler 2,082]

I didn't watch the game I was superstitious. But I definitely remember at the end of the game 1 GDT stating something of the sort of the Wings being much better in matinee games and apparently I was right on that one. I just watched the highlights, and I must say....great 2nd effort by Brunner, great jump in the play by Smith, what a nasty snipe by Franzen and my god Flip looked like a goal scorer on his one. I love seeing a game without the need for any garbage goals. Just nice hockey plays that find the twine.

[Guest Playmaker]

Playmaker, I just wanted to say that's a pretty good assessment of Danielle's play recently.

So what is the point of any of us discussing anything, then? Is this just a forum for us to say "I hope the wings win!". Come on, man.

Agreed. I don't think it's out of line to discuss frustrations with a player's performance. I think that's what a community like this is all about. But I do agree that it can get out of hand at times and can get downright ridiculous. I tend to give players, coaches and managment the benefit of the doubt. My posting history suggests that. But also, there comes a time when criticism is deserved. Franzen has been inconsistent. Filppula doesn't play to his abilities. Cleary's skills have declined considerably. There's a myriad of things that I can't necessarily change, but it doesn't mean I don't want to vent about them occasionally or discuss them with other like minded people.

I don't necessarily agree that fans have no influence. At the risk of bringing up the beloved Brandon Inge again, I think his release was the direct result of the booing and fan pressure. Leyland mentioned it, and it got to the point he couldn't play him at home. Truthfully, I'm stunned Cleary hasn't received more criticism than he has. I think had the Wings not made the playoffs, there would have been more.

FWIW, I brought up the "Danielle" thing in reference to those who were repeatedly calling Franzen "Francine"

[kylee 727]

I don't remember if it was on here or HF but someone said that post game interview of Toews looking shocked that they lost is hilarious. let's see him get REALLY shocked if they get bounced by us! Wings can do this! Babcock and the coaching staff know how to do something that is extremely hard to do against Chicago : neutralize their offensive by playing a puck possession, physical, grinding game. 3 more. This team really can do it...

[pucktividi 472]

Couldn't watch the game til now¸,but either Babcock motived them big time or simply brought Chicago newspapers in the locker room before the game.Great effort from the guys for the majority of the game.

Also like how Babs keeps on trolling the opposite coach again.First adding more skill to limit the Ducks physical play(Bert,Sammy)and now more grit to limit the Hawks skill(Miller).Wouldn't be surprised if we see Tootoo as well at some point of the series.

[Rhah 195]

Can't league office fine Toews for officiating criticism?

[GoWings1905 2,694]

The Red Wings obviously need a top-six winger this summer (have for years). I won't dispute that at all. However, right now what other option does Babcock have really to replace Cleary? "Anyone else" doesn't work either as a response because that's simply the easy way out and ignoring what Cleary has provided relative to the alternatives.

- Breaking up the third line isn't a viable solution. Brunner has thrived on the third line getting away from other highly skilled players. There's too much speed/chemistry there now and all three members have clicked playing together.

- Bertuzzi? I would agree here for sure had he not missed the entire season. Not his fault, but he looks slow and it would be a mistake to throw him into situations with more minutes during the playoffs.

- Samuelsson? Completely ineffective when he is healthy, which thankfully hasn't been often.

- Miller or Eaves? Both are 4th liners that are effective on the PK and forecheck/skate hard. Neither produces enough offensively to play in a top-six role for an extended period of time.

- Tatar? Everyone's wish, but not happening.

[Guest Crymson]

'Hawks fans have been all over Cleary too.